new clutch system

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can you move the engine any farther back, might need to open the oval screw holes on engine plate a bit, to allow the engine to go back a 1mm, then just add washers to the allen key bolts, just thinking out aloud here
 
any way of the spur gear moving back, perhaps if theres a washer making the spur gear sit forward, you could take the washer off making the gear sit back a bit

again just thinking out aloud
 
only other thing i can think of is some how moving the flywheel back, perhaps filing the back of the collet or maybe a shorter one
 
I don't have the stock plate it's the carbon fiber one. Well I could try and get the fly wheel back some but it's about as back as I can get it or not enough to make a difference I'll check though take some shims off the cap maybe.

But is 43 spur and 17 bell an ok gear ratio with trenches I don't want to over work the engine.
 
id have a 47t spur for a bit more acceleration, the trenchers are quite big and might need a bit more grunt to get turning
Gears_zpslbyshtf5.gif
 
Starting to think this clutch system was a waste it won't sit back enough that's as good as it gets and having to have a new bell sucks..lol. theres no way I can us my old bells? I could try 52 15 if I could use my older bell is there a way I can clean it?
 
I would lightly sand the inside of your bell and try to use that one with the new clutch system
 
thats exactly why i don't go with all these superduper fandangled crappy internet hyped bits (feel better now i said that), i just bought a new engine, flywheel and clutch, if you have too just buy the hpi flywheel and alloy 3 shoe clutch set, integy cos me only £18 complete flywheel and clutch, fits and works perfectly
the clutch bells are very hard wearing and can be cleaned up easily as jam said, bit of sand paper and wire brush
 
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If the shoes are making full contact it looks fine. Just be easy on the play. I'd recommend between .70-1.20mm on this one (I usually run .70 or less), The clutch will 'work' it's a matter of how well it will work., It's simply synchronizing the traction and RPM by harnessing that 'usable power'. Let us know how you like it.

How many shims behind the collet?
 
Girlypants, that's a pretty ridiculous attitude you have there. If you've not tried anything except "inexpensive" clutch setups, how can you judge?

I have tried all kinds so I can provide an opinion. The Buku clutch is one of the best on the market in any class. Having that "Aw ain't no use getting one of them fancy wancy clutch. I just wrap a spring around it....she moves" attitude is why so many guys like have crappy clutch setups and convince others to "go on the cheap" as well.

If you've not tried it then why do you have an opinion on it? That's just being a blowhard. (Feel better now I said it)

Post up a vid of your Integy clutch that 'works just fine'...I'd like to see that. Wats up lol
 
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GIRLYPANTS said:
only other thing i can think of is some how moving the flywheel back, perhaps filing the back of the collet or maybe a shorter one
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All this would do is bind the flywheel with the front bearing as the collet needs to be shimmed as is. It's not subjective, its fact...so what in the world is making you even suggest that? Also if you affect the taper its going to cause the flywheel to slip something fierce. Some folks do want to get it set up right, you know.

OP...this is nitro so not for the feint of heart. There's many ways to run in this hobby, and you decide how you want to. I've run stock for about 10-12 gallons as well so never did read what caused you to switch, In other words what is it you are looking for in a clutch. You bought a high-end clutch no doubt, but might as well take advantage of that...or at least I'd think

Also how in the world is the new bell causing any of this issue? It's the same bell. Just new.
??
It's the Savage design that is the issue. From engine mount to end of shaft, the distance to the spur is than any other 1/8 vehicle I've run. This is one reason the bell is short and they give you lots of end float.
 
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RickBoblee said:
Girlypants, that's a pretty ridiculous attitude you have there. If you've not tried anything except "inexpensive" clutch setups, how can you judge?

I have tried all kinds so I can provide an opinion. The Buku clutch is one of the best on the market in any class. Having that "Aw ain't no use getting one of them fancy wancy clutch. I just wrap a spring around it....she moves" attitude is why so many guys like yourself have crappy clutch setups and convince others to "go on the cheap".

If you've not tried it then why do you have an opinion on it? That's just being a blowhard. (Feel better now I said it)

Post up a vid of your Integy clutch that 'works just fine'...I'd like to see that
Click to expand...


Easy Now !!! all he did was express his opinion , I linked Sharkattack to the buku as he was looking for one to replace the one he could not get parts for. I too see a problem with the setup of this type clutch, No I have not spent 80 bux on a clutch for my rig and I feel that in most bashers type of running it just is not needed.
I see the gap between the bell and flywheel is a bit large and have to wonder if that will hurt performance, I also do not like the narrowness of the teeth on the bell, I like to get full engagement in this area and would be disatisfied with that gap being there and how the mesh looks to my tired old :eyes:

My son bought the Integy spur for his savage and the spur is way too narrow for my taste I think it accelerates wear to the drive gears, I know being wider also makes a bit more drag, but I will trade that for longeviety any day....
I have a set of alloy shoes and RR racing gears on my personal rig and am more than happy with the clutch and performance of the parts I am using....

Some guys like to have the latest and greatest parts on their trucks , I am just happy it works as intended and have a blast running my trucks of, which I have 6 nitro rigs and all have good and bad things about them, key thing is to know the limitations and run the vehicle within those parameters and have fun above all......
 
He gave his ('I feel better I said it') opinion but it's not based on anything. That;'s all. Unlike other clutch setups you have to get this one right because of the Savage design...this is what I've been saying. It can be done though. I've not run Integy which is why I don't dismiss it. Only those opinions that go against that rationale. Make sense? So yeah, I agree whole heartedly....run what you like. I missed where I said anything different. I only see where I'm defending what you said.
 
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Not saying you are wrong on the design aspect of this clutch, like I said above I have a problem with the bell gap to flywheel and the narrowness of the gear on the end... it looks like there is something amiss there and this makes me wonder how durable the gears will be in hard use.....

if ya take a look at the pics he posted you will see where the gears seem to be misaligned and that gap flywheel to bell just looks a bit large to me.... being a fiddler like I am I would have to find out why that is and how to make it better....
 
And if it helps, I can post up some pics of mine shimmed. This is with the stock bell, the HPI vented, and the RRP hardened clutch.
 
It's hard to say from the pics. The bell to spur looks fine, the bell looks like it is up too high but he has it shimmed too much down low. The bell will hit the flywheel with no shims.. He just needs to run .03 shims one at a time until the shoes no longer hit the top of the bell AND the bell covers 100% of the shoes. That with some play left over. What he wants to be concerned with above all is causing friction as komposite has the bit of alum and lasts 300x longer, but they can't get fouled. Speaking from experience here. ;-( I'll pop mine off and post the 'magic combination' I got for mine to work.
 
Yes, I totally understand what you are saying and I'm saying the same thing. 'Bell to spur good' means he has enough space. Dropping his inner shims will bring the bell down considerably (too much in fact). Once the bell covers the shoes the gears will be aligned. This, unless he put too many shims behind the collet. I run Buku on four other vehicles and on some vehicles I've been able to run one, and on some it's taken two. Start with one, ensure the flywheel does not bind (with the clutch nut tightened all the way) and then shim the bottom one at a time. Also don't worry about fitting the spacer once you shim the top because the play is what's important here--not just lining it up right, but doing so with the right amount of play..
 
RickBoblee said:
If the shoes are making full contact it looks fine. Just be easy on the play. I'd recommend between .70-1.20mm on this one (I usually run .70 or less), The clutch will 'work' it's a matter of how well it will work., It's simply synchronizing the traction and RPM by harnessing that 'usable power'. Let us know how you like it.

How many shims behind the collet?
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I have 4 shims that came with the clutch behind the culetollet which is recommended by buku. I have two shims behind the in bearing on the bell. I have alot of shims on the front of the bell cause otherwise after tighting the screw the bell would slid back and forth. there is a gap between the bell and the flywheel cause the depth of the bell. It does cover up the shoes completely.
 
I was looking for a clutch system with parts support, ease of use and will last me for a while I was recommended to buku and after look and reading there info I chose to try it cause my current clutch system I felt was working so well with my truck.

I did get to test it out today and already liking it, seems to get my truck moving better. I just don't like the restriction on spur gears they have to be thin cause the clutch bell is pushed for far up.
 
Where did you get four shims behind the collect from? That is your problem right there. ;-) All the instructions I have said use at least one and continue to fit your model. The idea with the number you need to properly align it, so try one and see if it binds or not. Also, for other folks the shoes rest on a bevel on the flywheel, so it's hard to say if he is covering the shoes or not. If it's spinning with no noise you are good there,
 
Your clutch bell is up to far because you have your collet shimmed up too much. Might be a good time to check on things now anyway, especially the bearings. Shoes should be tan'ish. Check the bell inside and out for any 'rings'. Did you adjust the stock settings yet?

Also what is a 'thin' spur gear? I've only run the stock and the Robinson racing one. I don't know about any restriction on running a thin gear. Where did you get that? You can run stock or RRP spur gears no problem. If you are running an aftermarket TVP that moves the wheelbase in the rear that is something to know though.
 
Also, be very careful when removing your collet. If you split the seam too much it can eventually cause the flywheel to slip. All in all it looks like you are doing good, Just reduce the collet shims and everything should line up. Also will be curious how your bearings look. Assuming they are new, if the outer race is a darkish color it most likely means you don't have enough play, but that is easy fix. If you just replace them, the new ones will eventually blow so attack it when you see it.
 
if it was "binding" what woukd it do? Well at the moment because the bell is so far up stock spur or the RR spur I have rub really bad on the bell, the thin spurs don't. I got 3 from buku's instructions I put 4 I cant say why...lol. no I haven't adjusted the stock settings on the clutch system.

What would the rings indicate and what do u mean rings..sorry I'm still learning the lingo :).
 
Yeah it all has to do with the # of shims behind the collet. It won't bind with two shims. Try that...you'll be surprised what a difference it makes. If after going down two shims it's still not perfectly aligned, try one,. To test binding, tighten clutch nut all the way and move piston to TDC. When moving the flywheel you should not feel anything 'gritty'. There's all levels of binding...it could be so bad the flywheel doesn't move at all as long as it is smooth...it's not binding.
 
Oh, and as for rings, look at the top of the bell when you take it of. If there is a silver ring going around it your shoes are hitting. Same with the outside of the bell (silver ring) indicating it is rubbing against something like your brake discs. You would have probably known it by know if it were but just good practice to check it.
 
I'm also curious about the instructions recommending three shims. I certainly believe you, just wondering as I have five Buku setups (spanning ABK M, H, and BBK) and they all state it requires "a" shim but the number used to fit your model. Just want to make sure I'm not missing something here as if they gave a count there is a reason. ?? Just don't let it frustrate you, there is a learning curve for sure. You're doing the right thing taking the time to get it right. I've dealt with a lot of clutch setups and as mentioned, it's the Savage that is a bit out of standard....that Buku fits on all other 1/8 vehicles,
 
I'm using buku's new crank Case caps and the instructions for it say you have to use at least 3 brass shims behind the collet. Suppose to help with front bearing air leaks. So I thought I would try them.
 
Ahh..... so that's for shimming the caps not the flywheel (which of course is affected). You have some decisions to make then as I doubt you can run both on the Savage. I'm sure those caps help but they are not a must have--where a well shimmed clutch is, IMO. The shims that Dave provides with the kit are plenty enough to get the job done but it never hurts to get a complete set. This is a good investment right here. http://www.amain.com/ofna-1-8-clutch-bells-shim-kit/p5428
 
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