Battery WARNING with FLUX and MMM.

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Larsenracing

Larsenracing

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Alright, figured I would post this so the guys that check this site before purchasing the FLUX and battery's or just going to 6S LiPo Set-up's.

MAKE SURE NOT TO SKIMP ON BATTERY WHEN GOING TO 6S.

You need a battery that will have more than 30C ratings on 6s. People have been blowing up ESC's and packs because of this. If you want more details search around.

Some have stayed with the 20T pinion and are fine with the lower C ratings.

For instance= http://www.e-savage.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4434
There are lots more out there.

Don't hesitate going to 6S just get the decent name brand packs and watch your temps. I'm sure there are others here that can fill more in on this.

:Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive: :Radioactive:
 
Larsenracing said:
Don't hesitate going to 6S just get the decent name brand packs and watch your temps. I'm sure there are others here that can fill more in on this.
Click to expand...

This is the important part. Honestly with these setups stock gearing can't be trusted. It really depends on the conditions you are driving in and how you drive as to what gearing you use. If you drive flat stick not stopping for a moment for a full pack you will probably find the weakest part in your setup smoking by the end of a full pack with stock gearing. Especially if you are doing hill climbs and driving in long grass etc. Also if you live in a hot climate like Australia your setup will get a lot hotter then the people in the US so you will not be able to gear as high. This could be reversed too when Australia is in winter and the US is in summer.

Batteries are the most important part of any electric setup. The car can only have as much power as the batteries can deliver. Lipos can deliver a lot of power but if you push them past their limits they die quickly.

Your batteries shouldn't get hot. For lipos in a car by the end of a full run should stay cool. This is general though because if the temperatures are freezing then you need to make sure your battery is warm (relative to ambient) before even going into the car but still not hot when it comes out. It's not really that hard you just have to keep in mind your ambient temps. If it is freezing (0c) and you stick your packs in the car and they are (23c) and at the end of a run your packs come out at (35c) you are obviously pushing the packs way too hard but the pack is still probably within the safe temp range stated by the manufacturer.

The other point where people make mistakes is soldering. Soldering the large gauge wire is not easy. It sucks heat away fast so if your iron doesn't have a large enough tip or enough power you will likely end up with a bad high resistance join. I hear stories of peoples solder joins coming apart after a bad jump. THIS CAN ONLY HAPPEN WITH A BAD SOLDER JOINT. If you can feel one wire is warm or hot compared to the other wires you have a bad join but just because one isn't hot doesn't always mean you have a good join.

All "Zippy" packs are not the same. There appears to be a difference between the different lines of zippy packs. The Zippy H packs seem to be one of the better zippy lines but I wouldn't know. I haven't tried them.

Flight power, Polyquest, Hyperion, Neu Energy and a whole bunch of others all make great packs. 25c is as low as you would wan't to go on a flux I would think but once again it also depends on the mah of the pack. A 30c 3000mah pack is not as good as a 25c 5000mah pack. And a 6000mah 25c is identical to a 30c 5000mah pack theoretically in regards to max amp delivery.

That's all I can think of for now.
 
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Great work and information buddy.

Also, Bryan from SMC stated the there is no formula or specification on how to get the C rating per battery and per manufacturer. I'm sure most packs in the same manufacturer are rated the same way but like said there is no specific way they get this. Which is why I say go name brand as they will be more accurate and will last much longer as far as complete life span.
 
Even name brands can be deceptive. What you will find though is that Enerland make the cells in most of the top quality packs and between the pack builders (flightpower, polyquest etc.) Those cells/packs all have identical ratings, size and weight.
 
I'm running two 3s 20C 4000mah Zippy Flightmax packs in my Flux. No problems so far really. The Fan DOES come on while running the truck, but the batteries are just warm after running, not hot or anything. I will keep an eye on them, but I think I should be alright.
 
My buddy is running the same set up but with Venom packs 3s 20c and 4000mAh. and the stuff stays cool. He's also on the stock 20T Pinion.

sgm182 what pinion ar you running. I have just heard with out the 35C + 6s setups to stay away from the 25T Pinion.
 
The whole C rating measuring system is a mess because some companies only rate their packs @ 80% or so of the capacity. The correct way to do this is by using 90% capacity which some companies do use, but not all. You may see 30 or 35C #'s on some companies packs but they are racted @ 75, 80 or 85% capacity which is misleading to the consumer. We have tested 18C 3400mAh packs in our Flux's with no issues other than on my truck one of the e-clip's on the top shaft in the tranny let go and made a mess of my gears(4 in all with missing or broken teeth), and the other truck in here lost teeth on just 1 gear, not e-clip related though. The 6S setup is way to much to every use successfully, although it is quite a spectacle. Our packs do get warm, but not excessively warm. This is the only applictaion(Savage FLUX) in which I have seen batteries get warm from running them. I'm not saying it's ok to run our 18C packs just yet. I'll be sending some to John and Collin @ hpi this week for some hardcore testing on their end and see what happens. We will have 5000 and 6000mAh 18C 3s packs in the near future.

Bryan @ SMC
 
The other problem being run into is that the HPI manual is a bit misleading. DO NOT USE THE 25T PINION unless you are running Phaltline or equivalent-sized road tires. If you use off-road tires, stick to the 20T, or even gear down. The advice I get everywhere is to gear for 40-45mph, which would be a 14T-16T pinion.

BTW, CC says to use a minimum of 5000Mah as well as 30C.
 
Ascender I believe what your saying is you are more than likely fine with off road tires but do want to keep the weight of these tires to a minimum. Meaning not running a heavy tire. Example on the heaviest end Pro-Line Big Joe's.
 
MTBikerTim said:
Even name brands can be deceptive. What you will find though is that Enerland make the cells in most of the top quality packs and between the pack builders (flightpower, polyquest etc.) Those cells/packs all have identical ratings, size and weight.
Click to expand...

I can attest to this one...my nearly new $190 Hyperion 4s pack just poofed while sitting on my R/C shelf un-used. Had a storing charge, was never mis-treated and poof. Lucky my house didn't get burned down.
 
wow thats crazy chris. glad your house and yourself are ok. these lipos can be dangerous. i keep mine in a locked fire proof box, so hopefully its ok if one ever does blow.
 
Some info i read on why our ESCs blow regrading gearing and lipos...

If you use very good LiPo packs that can supply enough required power to the ESC to use a 25t pinion you should be fine. Your only problem is the ESC getting very hot under all the stress and blowing. So 25t pinions are fine to use just watch your temps..... basically means do a few runs and let it cool down.

Another reason why your ESC will blow is a combination of doing high speed runs with a small pinion and braking.

If you are running your car fast and slamming on your brakes, this forces current back into the ESC and into the lipos. If you don't have decent enough lipos that can store the charge that comes back through the ESC then your ESC will blow.
When using a 25t pinion, it is better for braking as it returns current through your ESC slower than an 18t pinion would.

Have you seen the vids where people brake extremely hard and then blip the throttle and their ESC goes up in smoke?

This is why i prefer running mech brakes as it eliminates this issue all togehter, and the only thing you need to worry about is your temps on your ESC.

So be wary if you run a small pinion and use motor brakes as you can still blow your ESC through hard braking.
And if you gear to low (25t pinion) then you risk overheating your ESC....

If you have a flux, you should consider running mech brakes and then gear accordingly to the temperatures.
This is what i have done and i have never had any overheating issues and the last thing i worry about is my ESC blowing up (touch wood)

I hope this makes sense to people...
 
If you are running your car fast and slamming on your brakes, this forces current back into the ESC and into the lipos. If you don't have decent enough lipos that can store the charge that comes back through the ESC then your ESC will blow.
When using a 25t pinion, it is better for braking as it returns current through your ESC slower than an 18t pinion would.

Have you seen the vids where people brake extremely hard and then blip the throttle and their ESC goes up in smoke?

This is why i prefer running mech brakes as it eliminates this issue all togehter, and the only thing you need to worry about is your temps on your ESC.
Click to expand...

great info plus rep+
 
erm, is it helping if we use power capacitor? i've been using an LRP power cap on my 1/10 brushless combo becoz it was recommended so.. so i was thinking, can we use power cap on Flux ESC to help the current flow?
 
hmmm first i have heard of this... Do you just mean increasing the size or the number of capacitors on the current MMM? i think i may have seen someone do that, but unless you handy with this sort of stuff, i doubt many would try it.
Arent the new MMM like v5, have stronger built in capacitors to handle the spikes?
 
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