starting prob

[ANDY]

happy new year to everyone,through work,new job etc,not had much time to run my savage25,been in the shed for about 5 months,tried to start it but won't plug is ok seems to be flooding all the time i am still new to this any advise would be great:newb:

[[hs] darkshine]

maybe gloopy crud inside the engine, from the remains of the last run?

[Jeremy]

Your probably over primeing the engine take the glow plug out and crank the engine over watch your eyes tho I would also check your fuel has it set in the shed too (I keep my truck and fuel at room temp ) when I store it.. Get some fresh fule and a new plug and go from there ok man keep us posted

[ANDY]

there is a bit of crud in the carb just in the process of cleaning it had it going rev up really high then cut out. how do i take the carb off and where can i get an engine manual s-25,i have learnt my lesson on this one thanxs

[Stealth Attack]

There should be a screw just below the carb on the backside of it. And you can go to the hpi web site and look at the manual for any truck they have. Me personally i would pull the engine and pull the back plate off the motor and clean it out just to be on the safe side. A little wd40 would help in cleaning the inside. JMO!

[wullie]

http://www.hpiracing.com/graphics/instr/savage/s21_p47.jpg is all i can find for it. doesnt have a breakdown of the engine tho

[ANDY]

i've got it going to a fashion,stripped the carb put it back to factory settings and it started running really rough, when i brake it chokes the engine doesn't stall maybe carb wants setting up proper i just put in the twin brake hop up took engine and gear box out(must be an easier way)dont think i lined them back up proper,just ordered the new spur gear,it's all good fun though.any advice on tunning the carb for a newbie like me thanxs lads

[Cajunbasher]

i when i brake it chokes the engine

Sounds like you need to adjust your idle screw. When you apply the brakes the carb slide will close until it hits the idle screw, tighten it a little and that should cure that problem.

If your at factory settings it's probably a little rich, start leaning (turning clockwise) the HSN. For someone new tuning should be a very slow process, turn the needle about 1 clock position at a time then run the truck for a couple of passes...Repeat as needed. It's best to work on one needle at a time, always start with the HSN then move on to the LSN. The manual also explains this.

Good luck!

[Jeremy]

It that fule has been seating for that long I wouldn't use it in any of my engines

[ANDY]

hear what you are saying, just waiting on a new spur gear so i can start again thankxs.what are the most common hop ups to start with i have the twin brakes what next??

[Jt]

is it still fairly stock? fail safe, hump pack, throttle mod, steering servo, steering bearings, new pipe-- that is where I would start if the truck is still in stock form.

[Jeremy]

I would just get it to run right first

[[hs] darkshine]

lol!! :nutshot:

[ANDY]

i have the hump back and a fail-safe apart from that its stock.i planned on getting it running right first.i was taking out the carb and noticed there is a sleve where the carb slides into that is broke(this is a second hand one and the cond when i got it was diabollical) please tell me you can buy new ones??
also the bottom of the carb is not good the plastic bit that sits in the engine is all chewed up and i have lost the starting pin and pressure spring don't ask help!!:embarrassed:

[[hs] darkshine]

i have the hump back and a fail-safe apart from that its stock.i planned on getting it running right first.i was taking out the carb and noticed there is a sleve where the carb slides into that is broke

as in the case of the engine? even if it is, pretty much every part is available from a hpi retailer.

[k0m0d067]

the eBay chop shops part the engines out all the time...just look up "hpi crankcase" and you'll find a list of different people selling different crankcases for the various HPI motors...

[ANDY]

found out my engine is shot the piece in question is not available according to my local shop so i have a new engine comming very shortly its a savage x f4.1 please don't tell me its not good.will need advise about running it ini think it is comming on the 29th thnaks

[Jeremy]

You could allway get a new carb!!!!

[ANDY]

it's the piece that actually sits in the engine that is all broke so i think it is letting air in around the sides and mucking the mixture up

[Jeremy]

r u sure the carb sleeve didn't come apart and stick in the block that happend to me on my stock 25 mill
is there anyway u can get some clear pic of it?????

[ANDY]

i am in work now but i will but a pic up to-night, the bottom of the carb ,the plastic bit with the 'o' rings around, is eat up and the metal bit in the carb housing is shattered but i will post pic,thanks.

[ANDY]

HELP! i decided to put a new engine in my savage 25 it's the f4.1 i've had about half a tank through it whilst running it in it has already stripped a spur gear and it has gone nowhere yet,might have been too loose,but now it won't start.i haven't touched any settings on the carb seems to be flooding alot any help would stop me from throwing myself of the nearest tall building great forum lads thanxs:confiused:

[Jeremy]

heat the mill up with a blow dryer take the glow plug out and clear it out any exess fule then try again (don't prim it) if that don't work u might have to lean out the lsn like 1/4 turn keep us posted

[R6 DADDY]

were the gears meshed correct not to tight bad meshing can strip gears in no time

[ANDY]

tried all of the above still no joy it sounds as though it wants to start but just does'nt catch then the roto start battery fails scared of breaking the new engine anymore ideas please! thanxs

[Maxx-Savage]

Have you tried changing the glow plug?
Are you sure the glow starter is charged?
Did you try leaning it out a little?
It is a possibility you got a defective engine. my sav .21 came with a defective engine which HPI replaced for free if you have tried everything and it still wont start you can send it to hpi and they will replace it.

[Maxx-Savage]

Oh and is the owb still good?

[Jeremy]

loosen the glow plug when u start it it this should help and remember don't overprime it ...so u tryed heating he mill up to like 200 if u can get it that high right? might want to try and get a hotter plug aslo

[ANDY]

glow plug came with the engine everything is charged up!i am using a paint stripper hot air gun and the engine is hot to touch why will loosening the glow plug help? i am still on my first tank of fuel in the break in period it says use a full tank as per factory settings.will the outside temp be a factor it's about -4 at the moment but iam indoors.what is owb? thinking of taking it to my lhs but would like to solve it myself.thanks.

[[hs] darkshine]

loosening the plug will reduce compression, you only need to do it a fraction. a owb is a one way bearing, basically it sits at the rear of your engine, the rotostart plate attaches to it, in one direction it grips (when you fire the engine up) it spins the crank, in the other, or if engine rpm is grater than roto rpm (jammed button etc) it will slip, so the crank should not spin the roto backplate, or if it does, it will stop with a bit of friction on the bit the roto shaft goes into..

[votefordurden2008]

glow plug came with the engine everything is charged up!i am using a paint stripper hot air gun and the engine is hot to touch why will loosening the glow plug help? i am still on my first tank of fuel in the break in period it says use a full tank as per factory settings.will the outside temp be a factor it's about -4 at the moment but iam indoors.what is owb? thinking of taking it to my lhs but would like to solve it myself.thanks.

Andy - Loosening the glow plug will lower compression in turn making the engine easier to turn over. If you think the rotostart is not catching this is my recommendation.

While the block is cold, flush the area around the glow plug with some wd40 or nitro to clear dirt away. Pull the glow plug out of the engine and the air filter off the carb. Spray 3 - 5 heavy squirts of wd40 in the glow plug hole and in the carb with the throttle open. Elevate the front of the truck so the wd40 runs to the backplate area where the One Way Bearing is. Crank it over a bunch while the glow plug is out. Repeat this two or three times.

Turn the truck upside down, crank over the engine a few times to get any excess WD40 out of the engine. At this point since your glow plug is out, its a good time to pop it on your igniter and make sure it still glows bright. Put the glow plug back in, snug it down then loosen it slightly. Now here there is two schools of thought after using wd40.

1. Flood the engine by over priming it, pull the plug out and deflood it. This clears any wd40 out in the engine.

2. Don't prime the engine. Start it as normal and the truck will fire off the left over wd40 in the block and at the same time pull fresh fuel in with the vacuume.

I do the number two version. But its up to you, whatever you feel safe with. If your doing it inside and your block is room temp, don't bother heating it. Just clip the glow igniter on for 15 seconds then try to crank her over.

If the block is ice cold hit it with the heat gun till shes got some warmth to her, clip the glow plug igniter on. Let it sit for a few seconds and try to turn her over.

This is where having a rotostart kinda sucks, because you can't feel if shes flooding or not. You should beable to hear the slipping though if the one way bearing is still slipping. But it shouldn't be since we just flushed it with wd40. If you suspect shes flooding lean out the LSN a tad and try again.

If she starts, don't forget to tighten the glow plug up.

[wullie]

i think maybe you should take a trip to ur lhs. its all very well us telling you what to do but if u cant put names to parts yet its a bit futile. get it to ur lhs and get them to show you how to start it. ask them to point out certain parts to you, ie, HSN, LSN, OWB etc. it can be a bit complicated at first mate but dont worry, its all comes together pretty soon.

what about using a cordless drill to start it? if nothing else, that battery will last a bit longer for u. mind and turn the torque settings down on the drill tho incase u wreck the OWB.

[votefordurden2008]

Just noticed you said you were still within the first tank of breakin. Its not uncommon to foul glow plugs out during break in due to the rich settings. Definetly check it off the engine and make sure its glowing.

Also I said earlier that if the block is room temp not to bother heating it, but with it being a almost new engine you should heat it up.

Check the glow plug first before you do anything, simple things first save time and money.

[Jeremy]

nice post there 08 this mill should start if not lean outthe lsn like we said I had to lean out my buddies on his brand new sts because we couln't get it to run of breakin... I ened up leaning the lsn out by like a full turn KEEP US POSTED!!!!!

[R6 DADDY]

my x did same when i got it took forever to get it to run then it did a tank died and wouldnt start agai turne out to be over rich foulin the plug so i tweaked it didnt need much and it ran again

[ANDY]

thanks for all the suggestions i loosened the glow plug warmed the mill up and it fired first time just run a full tank of fuel through her at 7am GMT and it's about -5 oh it's feels good! will run second tank later today.is there anything else i should be doing whilst breaking in? sorry just don't know the acronym's yet.

[[hs] darkshine]

yaay! well done bud. go slow is the main thing! i usually run a tank through at idle and then the second tank, i blip the throttle every 30 secs or so to flushout the oil that builds up in the engine.

[ANDY]

thanks mate,i've run about half a tank at idle when i first put engine in then today a full tank at no more than half revs second tank doing the same again does that sound ok or should i leave it idling?

[wullie]

i ran 5 tanks at idle before i touched the throttle or any needles.

[ANDY]

i hear what your saying the slower i do this break in period the better and longer my mill will last.is it better to do the 3-4 tanks in one go or leave some time in between them?thanks for taking the time in answering questions you have probably answered hundreds of time before.

[wullie]

i read that you were to let the engine cool a bit between tanks. 10/15mins should do it tho! i ran 5 tanks thro mine in a shift at work. i made up a jig to hold the engine pipe and tank and just let it run in as i 'worked' away.

[[hs] darkshine]

i run 3-4 tanks at idle on a new mill, letting the engine cool between heat cycles (cup of tea/coffee) then blip the throttle every 30secs to a minute for a tank, then just, drive it round the garden at half throttle max, for maybe 3 tanks. then i'll take it to the local spot, warn it up properly 1/4 tank maybe, then start the tuning.

[wullie]

everybody has their own different ways of running in. aslong as u dont go leaning it out and revving the nuts off it in the first tank, you shouldnt do to much damage. i swear by 5 tanks at idle then tune from there. im sure more folk will give u more ideas too, go with what suits u better.

[[hs] darkshine]

it's like wullie says, everyone has their own technique, and people will say theirs is the best, i aint, but i find what i do works for me, but the bottom line is go slow, be patient and you will be rewarded my young apprentice. :buttshake: :spew: :buttshake:

[R6 DADDY]

i went by the book as hpi reccomended when i got it to run that was lol

[ANDY]

back to square one it's not starting again.i think roto-start and glow starter are playing up it wants to fire but just wont catch then the batteries ru ndown of mentioned objects,trouble with buying second hand the lad really mistreated the car.it does seem to flood quite abit or its maybe me ,it's not going to beat me.i only get an hour here and there with it. work commitments and the like.thanks.

[k0m0d067]

have you ried swapping out the plug when it "wants to fire"? I've had that problem, and a new plug fixed it up...

[R6 DADDY]

i try to keep a couple of spare plugs they are always handy to have around i would take the engine out and seal it up there may well be an air leak as there was on my brand new truck as for electric hang in there once you get your running right you will never look back. hope this is of some help to you
also is it new or old fuel

[ANDY]

fuel is brand new picking up a new battery for the starter today wil also get some glow plugs only joking about electric no sounds or smells no starting probs nah not for me.i will keep you posted thanks.

[polystyrene]

http://www.revo-world.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78

above link to pro break in procedure for engines, when you read through it make sense what they say about drawing ou the break in procedure.

take your time yes, but take your time to do it right, not draw it out over a long period of time i say

[k0m0d067]

awesome link poly! I just bookmarked it...I'll have to use that with my Axial .28 and my HB .46...been wondering what was the "best" method, since I keep hearing different versions...

[polystyrene]

im going to try it on my 2 new engines aswell, it makes sense at the end of the day.

i might have to keep a few socks on the engine head to keep the temps up though. its a bit chilly here just now

[ANDY]

i've fixed it proper this time the flywheel had come adrift from it's brass cone thing that locks it onto the crank shaft engine out tighten it back up started first time put a couple of tanks through it just needs tuning now it doesn't seem to tick over very well keeps cutting out also which screw do i start to lean her out with?THANK YOU to everyone who oferred a solution to my frustrating proplem it's nice to know there is someone to help,thanks.:partyon:

[[hs] darkshine]

a nitro engine doesnt like idleing for periods of time (well, shouldnt) as the crankcase gets clogged with oil (it builds up after the nitromethane is burned) which is why people blip the throttle to clear the mill out.

now, tuning. here's what i do:
get the mill warmed up, a couple of laps around a car park, then tweak the hsn (high speed needle) in 1/4 turn, test run, getting wot (wide open throttle/full throttle) and make sure there is a good whitey/blue smoke from the exhaust.

repeat until a turn in, then do 1/8 turn, for a half turn, i then go down to 1/16 turn, as to get it more precise.

what you are looking for, is no white smoke (engine running to lean, and no lubrication to the mill) and/or it bogging down. 'bogging down' is where the engine speed increses, then will drop down, prob stalling. if either of these happen i will richen (counter clockwise) the hsn up about a 1/4 turn.

if your carb has a lsn, (2 needle or three) i would leave it alone for the time being, unless like me it almost 'miss-fires' from a standing start, in that case, statr off with 1/16 turns (clockwise for lean, c-clockwise for rich)

some people use temp guns to tune, i personally dont. instead i listen to the mill and look fro white smoke from the throttle.

here's a linky that might help you out HERE!! (http://www.hpi-europe.com/show_video.php?lang=en&videoID=)
hope that helps bud.

[polystyrene]

darkshine;15426']

some people use temp guns to tune, i personally dont. instead i listen to the mill and look fro white smoke from the throttle.


very good point, you should always tune the engine by performance and blue/white smoke, never by temps.

temps should only be for checking purposes and reference

[[hs] darkshine]

i'm contemplating getting one. i know my mill was run in well (i know the guy i bought my sav from) and it runs well, just fro getting the temps right in this weather, i dunno if a sock is needed etc...

[ANDY]

put a couple of tanks through her yesterday running a bit rough still trying to tune her steering doesn't feel sharp big turning circles,feels great though, looking for mods now maybe a reverse module then some fancy bits.ant thoughts thanxs:oneshot:

[R6 DADDY]

hi andy where is st helens anywhere near me ? i live in darwen near blackburn hows it runnin now

[ANDY]

st helens is about 3/4 hour from darwen still wants tunning a bit more i guess experience is what it is all about but runs ok got it very wet seems ok though stripped a spur gear whilst at idle don't know why clutch bell got very hot and melted it is there a way of stopping that?where do you start first to make it look better wheels body chasis?thanks.

[Jeremy]

Might want to make sure (if your still running the brass wassher on there) That that washers is not worn out.. try shuffing up your shoes w/ sandpaper

[[hs] darkshine]

making it look good is all down to personal taste. i broke a shell so got a new dodge ram body, i broke the standard side chassis rails, so replaced them with some 4mm innovative rc low centre of gravity ones. i havent broke any wheels, but i bought some 40 series proline bowties on chayenne rims, as they look cool, and extend the width of the truck (much more stable now in corners) for the warm weather, i have the std sav wheels and tyres also for the gloopy stuff. i also have a set of proline maxx paddles, for no real reason apart form they look uffing cool!! i have only really replaced what i have broke....:nutshot: